suspension sag

[further_more]

Dear Jeep gurus,



I have a 95YJ with Old Man Emu leaves and shocks which gives me about 2.5" lift.



The suspension sags on the passenger's side about an inch (the shocks are

compressed an inch more that the left side, looking from rear.)



I've swopped the shocks and leaves from left to right and yet it still

sags one inch on the passenger's side.



I'm utterly puzzled. I don't want to get a new suspension cause that

doesn't seem to be the problem.



I currently trail the jeep without front anti-sway bar and rear track

bar.



Please help! Thanks a million.[addsig]

	Swaybar A sway bar (also stabilizer bar, anti-sway bar, roll bar, or anti-roll bar, ARB) is an automobile suspension device. It connects opposite (left/right) wheels together through short lever arms linked by a torsion spring. A sway bar increases the suspension's roll stiffness—its resistance to roll in turns, independent of its spring rate in the vertical direction.

[Jeepr89]

Sounds odd [img]modules/phpBB_14/images/smiles/icon_confused.gif[/img] Is there something you have on the passenger side that is alot heavier that the other side??? Other than that it just ain't right [img]modules/phpBB_14/images/smiles/icon_wink.gif[/img] [addsig]

[BigBlackJeep]

Does the Jeep looked tipped to the passenger side when you are parked on level ground? It sounds almost like a shock mount may be bent or something that is making the travel in the shock different- Since you switched the springs and shocks it pretty much rules out that the springs are tired on one side. Try measuring the total length of shock between the upper and lower mounts on both sides. If they are different then that is where the problem/solution is. I would say as long as it looks level and everything looks ok, just keep an eye on everything and make sure nothing else happens.

I assume that you don't have anything really heavy on the passenger side right? That would do it too- I know it sounds stupid, but I have been puzzled over some things myself that turned out to be something completely different....[addsig]

[Tug-n-pull]

Welcome to the land of jeep people! Sure do like you handle it is rather fetching to say the least. Have you contacted old man emu



<TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD><font class="pn-sub">Quote:</font><HR></TD></TR><TR><TD><FONT class="pn-sub"><BLOCKQUOTE> It sounds almost like a shock mount may be bent or something </BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE>



What Bigblackjeep said makes sence something has to be bent or busted if the shocks and springs have been swoped side to side and the sag stays. Good luck and keep us posted as to the answer if you get one. tug[addsig]

[further_more]

BigBlackJeep. Yep, the car tilts on the passenger side, looking from front.

The bumper is not parallel to ground. None of the mechanics in my area has solved it yet.

As it is a second hand car, I am unaware of its history.



Could a bent shock mount of + - 1 inch cause the sag? I'm guessing that

the springs lifts the car and not the shocks. I've checked all spring mounts and they are ok.

shackles are all equal length too. There are no heavy objects on the passenger side either.



I'm guessing that something is causing the passenger side suspension to compress an inch.

Could it be the front track bar pulling or pushing since the frame's now 2 inches taller from the OME lift?



I live in Malaysia and OME here is of no help at all.





[addsig]

	Track bar A track bar is a component of a car suspension system that provides lateral location of the axle. While the purpose of the rear suspension of an automobile is to allow the wheels to move vertically with respect to the body, it is undesirable to allow them to move forward and backwards, or from side to side. It is this latter movement that the track bar is designed to prevent. It is a simple device, consisting of a rigid bar running sideways in the same plane as the rear axle, connecting one end of the axle to the car body or chassis on the opposite side of the vehicle. The bar is attached on either end with pivots that permit it to swivel upwards and downwards only, so that the axle is, in turn, allowed to move in the vertical plane only.

[Snitty]

Is it just the bumper, could it be bent down creating the illusion????? or is it the entire frame, which could also be bent



Could it be a body mount, again creating an illusion, and you are actually seeing the body higher from the bumper on one side? or are they actually different heights from the ground?



Look and see if the spring mounts on the frame are in the same place on their relative sides... someone might have broken one at one time and modified it to hold again.



I will assume that you are smart enough to run the same sized tires. That would surely do that. If you have mud meats and your tread is worn much more on one side.. that could cause it.



Your axle tube could be twisted, causing one wheel to caster further forward or back than the other. This could also result from a broken/bent spring perch



Do you get full flex on both sides... your tracbar or swaybar could be preventing the right movement



Has it been lifted... if so... the tracbar may have pulled the axle over to create uneven stance



Well... that's all I can think of for now... as for the shock mounts... disconnect the shocks, if your problem is a shockmount, it should straighten up... actually.. same goes for the tracbar and swaybar as well... if it goes to where it should be.. you found the problem... and that is just covering the front end... there could also be a flaw in the rear that is causing your front to disalign... limitless possibilities... but hey... that's what a jeep is all about right?[addsig]

	Swaybar A sway bar (also stabilizer bar, anti-sway bar, roll bar, or anti-roll bar, ARB) is an automobile suspension device. It connects opposite (left/right) wheels together through short lever arms linked by a torsion spring. A sway bar increases the suspension's roll stiffness—its resistance to roll in turns, independent of its spring rate in the vertical direction.

	Caster Caster angle is the angular displacement from the vertical axis of the suspension of a steered wheel, measured in the longitudinal direction. It is the angle between the pivot line (in a car - an imaginary line that runs through the center of the upper ball joint to the center of the lower ball joint) and vertical.

[MudderChuck]

Got me curious, just thinking out loud. A track bar (panard) type leaf spring compression, uses the laterial (sideways) flex of the leafs as part of the spring rate.

Might be worth 15 minutes to measure how far the left steering nuckle is from the frame, carpenters level held verticaly on the frame and measured to a point on the steering knuckle and then repeated on the other side (the whole body might be a little to the right of center). If you unbolt the top of the track bar what happens? Many lift kits come with a dropped track bar mount. If you unbolt the track bar arm you can push the body quite a ways, try shoving it towards the drivers side and see what happens.

Might also tell something, if the sring eyes and the bottom of the spring pack seem to be parallel.

I´d have a real close look at the spring pads, U-bolts stretch, the springs could be rocking on the spring pads. Very little play at the spring pad could, translate into quite a bit at the frame.

A rather hefty gal came in with her Volkswagon, said it was making a strange noise, she was right, it sounded just like a groan to me. The whole car tilted to the drivers side. [img]modules/phpBB_14/images/smiles/icon_wink.gif[/img] [addsig]

	Track bar A track bar is a component of a car suspension system that provides lateral location of the axle. While the purpose of the rear suspension of an automobile is to allow the wheels to move vertically with respect to the body, it is undesirable to allow them to move forward and backwards, or from side to side. It is this latter movement that the track bar is designed to prevent. It is a simple device, consisting of a rigid bar running sideways in the same plane as the rear axle, connecting one end of the axle to the car body or chassis on the opposite side of the vehicle. The bar is attached on either end with pivots that permit it to swivel upwards and downwards only, so that the axle is, in turn, allowed to move in the vertical plane only.

[further_more]

Is it just the bumper, could it be bent down creating the illusion????? or is it the entire frame, which could also be bent

----- No illusion, bumpertip to ground was measured. Raised jeep up. Body sits level, the hardtop is level, windshield frame is level. -----

-----Checked crossmembers, no sign of cracks. Don't think frame's bent.



Could it be a body mount, again creating an illusion,

---No again. Measured from frame base to body bottom. All equal length with the 3inch body lift.



Look and see if the spring mounts on the frame are in the same place on their relative sides.

-----Ok will check this. thx.



I will assume that you are smart enough to run the same sized tires.

-----Yes, running 32x11.5 on all four ends.



Your axle tube could be twisted, causing one wheel to caster further forward or back than the other. This could also result from a broken/bent spring perch

-----Ok will check this too. Spring perch all ok.



Do you get full flex on both sides..

----- Articulation is excellent.



Has it been lifted... if so... the tracbar may have pulled the axle over to create uneven stance

----- I removed the front trackbar. There was no preload on it. It slid right off without resistance. Will remove them tonight again and leave it for a few days to see if jeep levels out.



Well... that's all I can think of for now... as for the shock mounts... disconnect the shocks, if your problem is a shockmount, it should straighten up... actually.. same goes for the tracbar and swaybar as well... if it goes to where it should be.. you found the problem... and that is just covering the front end... there could also be a flaw in the rear that is causing your front to disalign... limitless possibilities... but hey... that's what a jeep is all about right?

----- removed shocks but not springs and the car still tilts.



-----Yeah, it's a jeep thing: You're jeepin even when you're not in it. ; P[addsig]

	Swaybar A sway bar (also stabilizer bar, anti-sway bar, roll bar, or anti-roll bar, ARB) is an automobile suspension device. It connects opposite (left/right) wheels together through short lever arms linked by a torsion spring. A sway bar increases the suspension's roll stiffness—its resistance to roll in turns, independent of its spring rate in the vertical direction.

	Track bar A track bar is a component of a car suspension system that provides lateral location of the axle. While the purpose of the rear suspension of an automobile is to allow the wheels to move vertically with respect to the body, it is undesirable to allow them to move forward and backwards, or from side to side. It is this latter movement that the track bar is designed to prevent. It is a simple device, consisting of a rigid bar running sideways in the same plane as the rear axle, connecting one end of the axle to the car body or chassis on the opposite side of the vehicle. The bar is attached on either end with pivots that permit it to swivel upwards and downwards only, so that the axle is, in turn, allowed to move in the vertical plane only.

	Caster Caster angle is the angular displacement from the vertical axis of the suspension of a steered wheel, measured in the longitudinal direction. It is the angle between the pivot line (in a car - an imaginary line that runs through the center of the upper ball joint to the center of the lower ball joint) and vertical.

[1bigmf]

i have it !!!!!!!!!!!!! if you check your motor it just sits a little to the passenger side...

me too,,, looks better when my swaybar is on ... also your tranny and t-case sits just a hair off too... [img]modules/phpBB_14/images/smiles/icon_smile.gif[/img] be cool brother[addsig]

	Swaybar A sway bar (also stabilizer bar, anti-sway bar, roll bar, or anti-roll bar, ARB) is an automobile suspension device. It connects opposite (left/right) wheels together through short lever arms linked by a torsion spring. A sway bar increases the suspension's roll stiffness—its resistance to roll in turns, independent of its spring rate in the vertical direction.

[MORGSTER]

Here is another item to check.

Sometimes Jeepers that install spring lifts use shims or wedges to correct differential angles find themselves with a crooked Jeep. The factory shims are bolted to the spring pack with a single hole. Some aftermarket shims use a slotted hole that clamps in between the spring pack and the mount. If one shim is slid to the front of the slot and the other is slid to the rear, or if one is upside down (it changes the thickness at a given distance), which changes the body height. I have seen this make a difference. Also shim thickness by brand can be the culprit.

To check this out, find the same spot on each side shim (at the center bolt hole and measure the thickness. [addsig]

[crazy-canuk]

just a thought... what type of battery did you use... i know old man emu suspension is suppose to be soft... i'm just thinking IF you have a dual battery setup that's an extra 50 pounds on that side... along with any gear you might carry that might sag out the springs.... other then that every one here has given you really good suggestions.... i recomend you go through this list.... just my $0.02[addsig]