More about that little offroad incident I told you about

[Jeepster05]

All of the problems are now showing up in my uncles TJ. Remember the story I told Ya'll about me and my uncle goin out 4 wheelin and getting caught in that water trap?? Well now the whole deal is going to court. My uncle's clutch and alternator are shot because of water damage. Damage bill topped $1000.[addsig]

[Jeepster05]

it wasn't my jeep it was my uncle's. My uncle is taking them to court for the damages.[addsig]

[judge09]

isnt this the story where you were off roading in a place you were not supposed to be? We are running into quite a few of those types of problems with restricted areas between mountain bikes, ATVs, Jeeps vs. the landowner. The courts say landowner wins. Goodluck but it sounds like a waste of time. Unless the judge owns a jeep.[addsig]

[Snitty]

But then again.. there are frivolous lawsuits all over every day... If someone is walking up to your front door, and they fall on your sidewalk, you can get **** on... its BULL$HIT... but its true... If you make a mistake... then YOU forked up... and YOU take responsibility... that "you" is not directed toward jeepster... just toward anyone in any situation similar to the mentioned[addsig]

[Bounty__Hunter]

I agree with the trespass argument, they SHOULDN'T have a valid case. But, with all the frivilous complaints out there that win, they may get it by. Especially since the owner knew jeepers frequented the area and purposely created a hazard, that's negligence.[addsig]

[Jeeper89]

this story takes away from off-roading.if i was a land owner and had jeeps driving all through my property and didnt like it i would create a hazard.if u didnt have permission from the land owner then u were the one who broke the law not him.and if u were on ur buddies land and did the same thing would u sue him or neone.it common sence that you can mess up ur vehicle at netime when u are on the road or off the road.i mean some people really have no common sence.its a concequence that u have to take when u off-road and everyone knows that.this is just my opinion[addsig]

[jeepin_madness]

<TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD><font class="pn-sub">Quote:</font><HR></TD></TR><TR><TD><FONT class="pn-sub"><BLOCKQUOTE>this story takes away from off-roading.if i was a land owner and had jeeps driving all through my property and didnt like it i would create a hazard.if u didnt have permission from the land owner then u were the one who broke the law not him.and if u were on ur buddies land and did the same thing would u sue him or neone.it common sence that you can mess up ur vehicle at netime when u are on the road or off the road.i mean some people really have no common sence.its a concequence that u have to take when u off-road and everyone knows that.this is just my opinion</BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE>



This is where I differ from most of the opinions here. Yes if they were in an area where they weren't supposed to be then they were in the wrong. But if someone is illegally on your land it doesn't give you a right to create a hazard as you call it to stop or possibly injure them. There are legal means to stop trespassers. Find out who they are and have local law enforcement talk with them. If it continues then go to the courts for legal action. Most trespassing laws are wrote to the effect that unless posted the individuals must be given a warning first, and then afterwards legal action can be taken. If it is posted that is their first warning. Sure if someting is naturally there that you hit that messes up your vehicle or hurts someone riding in it you can chalk it up as things that can happen on the trail. But setting up something that in this case very well could have injured someone is just plain stupid. That shows pure intent to do destruction and/or bodily harm and really isnt cool. [addsig]

[Jeepster05]

We wouldn't have a case if there had been NO TRESPASSING Signs anywhere in the area that we were wheelin. For a few decades this place has been a local 4 wheeling pit and there has never been any signs or anything. It wasn't privately owned land, it was the city's and my uncle (The owner of the jeep) works for the city. The person who dug the trap didn't work for the city.[addsig]

[Jeepster05]

And also like madness said someone could have gotten hurt like the 5 year old kid that was riding shotgun when we nosedived into the water (he didn't know how to swim and the water was supposedly 6-7 feet deep). We stopped right on the ledge of the trap and water came rushing in. Maybe we were innadvertantly wrong but my little cousin could have drown had t he doors not been on. Again this land was not marked or gated off. People have been wheeling there for years.[addsig]

[Snitty]

With no intent to sound cocky or anything like that... There IS a purpose we buy good parts for our jeeps and try to make them so they won't break often.... If we could sue someone that owns land that we drive on... I would buy bottom of the line **** all the time, with the intent of it breaking... that way I can get money when stuff breaks. BUT... I will go ahead and totally agree that it was WAY WAY over the line for the landowner(the city) to build a trap. BUT THEN AGAIN... I don't think the city would hire someone to build a trap... and it was likely a person who was ALSO trespassing that is responsible... and NOT the city(landowner)... (this is all IF i understand correctly, if not... then i'll agree that i make no sense)[addsig]

[Jeepster05]

The city didn't give the guy permission to make the traps. He was like the guy that cuts the grass on the soccer fields or sumthing. [addsig]

[jeepin_madness]

<TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD><font class="pn-sub">Quote:</font><HR></TD></TR><TR><TD><FONT class="pn-sub"><BLOCKQUOTE>The city didn't give the guy permission to make the traps. He was like the guy that cuts the grass on the soccer fields or sumthing. </BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE>



Wouldn't think the city would have someone make the traps anyway. it would be setting themselves up for one big lawsuit if someone got hurt.[addsig]

[Snitty]

thats exactly my point... so the landowner(city) should not be responsible for it. If anyone... the jerk that made that trap should be responsible[addsig]

[bigTlilODD]

If there are no "No Tresspassing" signs, you have a decent case. Also, I would push the seriousness and dangers of that pit. Like, kids falling in, or the fact that it's now full of oil and gas and animals are going to drink it, that it's standing water and will bring mosquitos (west nile virus and all that.) Go back there with a video camera and tape the EXACT route you drove. If there are signs there now, tape and take pictures of where they are planted, you should be able to tell by the color of the dirt if they're new. I would even go as far as to partially dig up the sign and photograph the post to see if there is any sign of rotting in the wood. That would help to prove that the sign wasn't there very long.



[addsig]

[Snitty]

And again... if its not posted, or wasn't... then the person who dug the trap (NOT THE LANDOWNER) should be responsible... not the landowner[addsig]

[Jeepster05]

my uncle isn't going after the city since he works for t he city. He'll go for the jackass who dug it.[addsig]

[Jeepster05]

my uncle isn't going after the city since he works for t he city. He'll go for the jackass who dug it.[addsig]

[Snitty]

ahhhhh... sounds fair.... but do you, or does he, know who dug it[addsig]

[Snitty]

hmmm... now that could make for a case[addsig]

[jeepmaster]

the pit digger should be burned at the stake[addsig]