***350 V-8***

jhiggins · #1 (**permalink**) 07-20-2003, 08:00 PM

How hard would it be to swap out my AMC 258 for a small block 350??? What all would I need to do and buy? Or maybe someone knows about a pretty cool web site?? Or maybe a better engine upgrade??? :-O :-O :-O [addsig]

chinard · #2 (**permalink**) 07-20-2003, 08:00 PM

its apparently pretty damn easy and well documented as far as swaps go.
I hear the stock gearbox and cooling system will have to be upgraded, but the engine mount kits are plentiful and not too expensive.
Just try doing a couple of quick yahoo or google searches for jeep 350 swaps and you'll get some great documents.

I'll probably do a 350 swap on my CJ next year. This year's project is gonna be the body work :-D[addsig]

Sully · #3 (**permalink**) 07-20-2003, 08:00 PM

Advance adapters should have motor mounts and that sort of stuff.I think you will need a new tranny and I heard some where that V8's snap stock axles with large tires.Just somthing to think about. :wink: Sully[addsig]

jps4jeep · #4 (**permalink**) 07-20-2003, 08:00 PM

If you wanna keep it a 5 speed, you can get a custom bell housing from autozone to mate a 350 with a ford 5 speed out of a 80's stang (what were those t5's or the tremec I am a chevy guy)

Johnny[addsig]

66tuxedopark · #5 (**permalink**) 07-20-2003, 08:00 PM

There are a few ways to get around this one.. the easiest is to call novak or advance and get the adapters you need however like in a previous post that v-8 is gonna be rough on the rest of the drive line, especailly the tranny, dunno which jeep you are talking about but either way you have to take it easy, me being me and loving inline 6's I would call clifford and look into rebuilding the 6, trust me it can make all the power you will ever want with a good rebuild and the right parts..

BUBBA[addsig]

Jeeppicus · #6 (**permalink**) 07-20-2003, 08:00 PM

To each his own, but I'm against dropping anything into my Jeep that is not a Jeep part. Most Jeeps around here are just Chevy drivetrains under a Jeep body. I want to show people what a complete Jeep can do. Thats why I'm dropping in a 258, even though I have a friend selling a 350 for cheap.[addsig]

firemanharry · #7 (**permalink**) 07-20-2003, 08:00 PM

AMC should have felt the same way about parts in their Jeeps. It seems like my 83 has more GM and Ford parts in it from the factory than geniune AMC stuff, guess it was cheaper that way.
Anyway, I've got a fuel injected 350 and an SM465 waiting to go into my CJ. I need an adapter between the 465 and the D-300(about $400), motor mounts(about $100), wiring harness, chip, fuel pump(about $500), and custom exhaust($300-$500). Good thing I already had the motor, tranny, and fuel injection. :-O
Then there is the rear issue, because I'm figurin' that the AMC 20 ain't gonna like it. Looking for Scout 44's for it, if anyone has a line on a set, or at least a rear somewhere around NJ please let me know.
[addsig]

jterp · #8 (**permalink**) 07-20-2003, 08:00 PM

i tend to agree with jeeppicus.... why not just build a chevy? and from my experience, no engine swap is ever easy, especially if it entails a drastic change in size. If you want some more power get the supercharger and bolt it on to the 6 in an afternoon--- still a jeep with comparable results.[addsig]

Snitty · #9 (**permalink**) 07-20-2003, 08:00 PM

overbore, supercharger, cam, rocker arms

but then... you can't get much more bad axx than a v8

edited by: Snitty, May 28, 2003 - 01:50 PM[addsig]

Snitty · #10 (**permalink**) 07-20-2003, 08:00 PM

a supercharger is a supercharger... if they make one for something, its made for all.... not mounting it and making it fit is a different story... since we have a low compression ratio, we are cabale of a good amount of boost... you can always slap on a 4.0 head and intake (not quite "slapping it on") and use the 4.0 supercharger[addsig]

66tuxedopark · #11 (**permalink**) 07-20-2003, 08:00 PM

Yup you can supercharge any engine, even you 3 HP Briggs if you know what you are doing. BUt without boring/stroking/blowing or any of that.. well ok an overbore may be necessary for the rebuild.. anyhow the 258 can be a beast with some good old fashioned hot rodding. Look at it like this if the wings and bling crowd can get 2.0L honda's to run in the 9's you can get a 4.2 L to run with a 350.. Trust me here.. take a look at Clifford performance, they specialize in 6 cyl performance. The V-8 is ok but why be like everyone else I am so sick of the 350, yes it is a good engine but it is BORING, I am a car nut but I am so sick of car shows because you can easily predict the drive line in just about any vehicle, jeep or otherwise. 350/350/9 inch... Just to make A point my next project after the CJ-5A is a 1972 AMC Hornet. The plans are laid for a Hesco or Golen stroked 4.0 out of a cherokee (blown) and backed by a Tremec 5 speed, now hows that for original? ANyhow dude the point is love your 258.. just like fat chicks they need love too..

BUBBA[addsig]

jps4jeep · #12 (**permalink**) 07-20-2003, 08:00 PM

I thought it was T5, but unsure, I know camaro's came with T5 and then T56's

A very good friend of mine did this with a 89 wrangler but put in a 305 rather than a 350 and he has no low gear issues. Drives the same as my AX15, even stock YJ trannies didn't come with the low grannie gears that I learned to love that was in my 77 blazer.

Did CJ's ever come with ultra-low first gear (or just Low gear)??

Johnny[addsig]

jterp · #13 (**permalink**) 07-20-2003, 08:00 PM

...or if you're really into doing a swap go for a chrysler 360 --at least keep it in the mopar family[addsig]

mandarrin · #14 (**permalink**) 07-20-2003, 08:00 PM

v8 its not a big deal.i was driving home yesterday and so this big as truck stuck in the mod and it was 4x4. i have a 4 banger and i know i would have gotten stuck there.my point is you better stick with jeep parts.a jeep is a jeep and its build to do its job well.[addsig]

hi_c · #15 (**permalink**) 07-20-2003, 08:00 PM

Yeah, stay with the 6cylinder. If you had a 4cylinder, maybe then it'd be worth it, but it'd be so much cheaper to get it rebuilt, over-bored (.030 or .060) and get a nice intake, possible supercharger and modified exhaust. You will be quite surprised. As light as the SWB Jeeps are, a V8 is too much power for it. As the years went on, the 6 cylinder got stronger and that, along with cheaper, are the reasons they don't offer the v8 360ci in SWB Jeeps anymore.

Bottom line, stay with the 258.

C 8-) [addsig]

firemanharry · #16 (**permalink**) 07-20-2003, 08:00 PM

Actually, I think the insurance industry is why they don't put V8's in SWB jeeps anymore.

[addsig]

jterp · #17 (**permalink**) 07-20-2003, 08:00 PM

what does the insurance industry have to do with anything? DC doesnt care how much you have to pay to insure a jeep... they certainly dont have to pay to insure your jeep themselves. Does the insurance industry prevent them from selling the 500 HP viper? From putting a 340 HP hemi into the new trucks? Did it stop them from putting the 5.9L v-8 into the Grand cherokee (for 2 years, until it proved that it wasnt going to sell)? With today's technology they could easily put the 318 from the grand cherokee into a TJ, give it 280 HP and make it just as safe and reliable. That would be a $30,000 wrangler though, and there is simply no demand for that. A majority of the people will always buy the cheapest cars-- the enthusiast market is a very small one. DC does not put a V-8 in a wrangler because of one thing ---- $. It would cost a lot to engineer the vehicle, and there would not be enough sales. [addsig]

firemanharry · #18 (**permalink**) 07-20-2003, 08:00 PM

Insurance companys have alot to do with what manufacturers build. I'd be willing to bet that if they made a limited production run of V8s in a TJ they wouldn't have a problem selling them.

[addsig]

jterp · #19 (**permalink**) 07-20-2003, 08:00 PM

But selling a "limited run" would not cover the overhead cost of engineering a new v-8 wrangler platform. And what does that have to do with insurance companies? I don't see any correlation -- I don't even think that a V-8 wrangler would be that much more to insure.[addsig]

Snitty · #20 (**permalink**) 07-20-2003, 08:00 PM

think of it this way.... there is a reason that insurance companies charge higher rates for such horsepower. they feel that it is much more dangerous, and frankly, it is... i LOVE power, and know how to use it... but many don't... insurance companies DO NOT want you to use insurance, but they REALLY want you to buy it. if people got 300+ hp in a SWB jeep, chances are, accidents will happen with them, statistics prove it... AND... if the insurance companies have to fork out money for those accidents, it is in their favor NOT to insure high power vehicles...

PLUS....

because of the higher insurance rates on high power vehicles, manufacturers will keep their power down, or even under-rate the power of their vehicles... They want people to buy them.. and if the insurance is going to kill people, then people won't buy... its a great marketing scheme... if i was to manufacture vehicles, i would not want the customers shying away because of the insurance rates, so i'd underrate or cut the power, that way, the insurance company will be easier on the consumer, and the consumer will be happier with the vehicle... Look at GM's LS1... in the late Trams Am and Camaro (God rest their departed divinity)... they are rated at around 325 horsepower stock... but put one on a dyno.. there have been cases of stock Fbodies producing over 365 horsepower...
Another reason for the underrating of the Fbody is because of the Vette, they would not want them to rape glory away from GM's king... the basic factor in the vette's performance being better is the weight/body design/suspension... if people realized they can get something just as good, for much cheaper, they will do it... the same thing goes for other companies as well...
To conclude, the insurance companies do not CONTROL the regulation of horsepower... but they are a big factor in why manufacturers will not produce the muscle they used to.

And to answer an earlier question... if you want to swap a 4.0 head onto a 4.2, it will not take heavy modification, but will require some...
if you simply want the head for flow reasons, it should bolt up quite easily.. but the 4.0 head is a little wider, so you'd have to plug some of the coolant holes, no big deal... if you want it for fuel reasons... you'll need the computer, intake, sensors, and fuel pump as well..
as far as supercharging it... if you order a supercharger from ATI Procharger for a mustang, and then for a camaro... you'll notice the unit is EXACTLY the same... the only difference you get is the bracketry.. you only need something to push air into the intake... but depending on the engine you charge, you need to consider limiting the boost, aftercooling (intercooling) the highly compressed air, and many other guidelines for the engine's safety... not all motors can take the same boost, but they can all be boosted...
other options are availible too.... i'm not sure on the wall thickness of the 4.2... but i do know that 4.0 pistons are much wider, and if swapped, can create a great displacement advantage, but if the walls could not handle it, you didn't hear it from me...
there's always turbos... which is "old fashion supercharging"... you can take a turbo from anything and adapt it to fit.. then again... cooling, boost, etc...
an onboard air compressor can make a great supply for a holding tank for a short term oxygen boost... you can plumb a valved tank to your intake tube, and on demand, you can force a load of air into your intake, boosting your charge once again... but this would be a VERY short term temporary boost which could only be used for small periods of time... ford is doing something similar with the new SVT Lightning... they have a holding tank in which pressurized air is held and cooled by the AC unit, and the driver can pop in a shot of cooled, compressed air at any time in short cycles, and it recharges itself in less than a minute... its much like nitrous oxide, on a lower scale, but no need to refill the bottle, it fills itself...
you can get creative in many ways, just have to think outside of what the world tells you

WOW.. that is a LOOONG post... bed time now[addsig]