Kerry

[wm69]

On the abortion thing, I used to think it was the choice of the woman. That's one more thing the govt doesn't need to get involved in. Now that I have a child and another on the way....... well, just say it changes the way you look at things. Hearing a heartbeat two months into the pregnancy means that's a life in there. We judge death by when a heart stops, so shouldn't we judge life by a heartbeat? I'm still undecided on whether it should be legal. I don't like the govt being able to stick it's nose wherever it wants to. I figure people who make the decision will answer to a much higher power later on, not to mention having to live with themselves in the meantime.
Miguez, does that mean you don't want to talk about gun control and car control anymore? :lol:

 

[Deerhunter30]

Abortion...from where I stand it is very simple:
Life begins at conception....
Ending a life without just cause (executing a criminal) is murder.........
Abortion is murder......
Murder is illegal....
Abortion is illegal.

 

[90Xjay]

The only time I could ever agree is in desperate situations of terminal illness that could be diagnosed early but it would have to almost be in the first trimester for me to believe in it or god forbid a child or pre-teen got raped and ended up pregnant.

Lady,
Not picking on you, but that is a flawed mentality in my opinion. For years we have been looking at rape the wrong way. We kill the baby and let the rapist live. Why not kill the rapist and let the baby live? A whole bunch of couples who cannot have children could adopt the child and would love it unconditionally.

All of these moral arguments are good to be discussing openly. But when we are questioning what is right or wrong to each of us we should question, who gave us the idea that something is right or wrong? If we have laws to live by, who is the "law giver". To me, most of these discussions boil down to:

1) There is either a God or not. (if not, then just go on and do whatever to whoever and grab all of the gusto you can. When you die, your worm-dirt)

2) If there is a God, then we all will have to answer to him.

Most people have a pre-planted sense of what is right and wrong, where does that come from?

 

[MerkL]

I like the bumper sticker that say "Gun control means using two hands." Take from it what you will, and twist my words around all you want.
Now to the Kerry pictures that started this thread before it was jacked....I think Kerry looks like Beaker from the muppet babbies. If you've seen it, you'll know.

 

[LadyJeepFreak]

XJ, I didn't mention the punishment for the rapist in my thread. I was only speaking from the viewpoint of abortion. I believe in the death sentence in any manner it is given to those who deserve it. I think adoption is fantastic too.

Either way, its a shame anyone is ever in that situation in the first place and I pity the girl that has to make this decision.

 

[TerryMason]

I just want to give mingez some props - he seems to be a very articulate individual.

 

[mingez]

I just want to give mingez some props - he seems to be a very articulate individual.

Thanks Terry! :wink: I are trying to talk gooder.

Abortion...from where I stand it is very simple:
Life begins at conception....
Ending a life without just cause (executing a criminal) is murder.........
Abortion is murder......
Murder is illegal....
Abortion is illegal.

Oh Crimmeny, why oh why did I use Abortion as an example. Really guys, this is a bad subject to talk about....really. Can 'O worms baby! Can 'O worms.

Miguez, does that mean you don't want to talk about gun control and car control anymore?

LOL, I know, let's compare Sword control to Horse and Carriage control. :lol:

 

[TwistedCU]

:lol: Twisted how many kids do you have? LOL I would have never guessed your against abortion!LOL

Yeah, I guess it's kind of obvious when you have lots of children :lol:

We have four children. We lost a baby not too long ago (miscarraige). It was a complete shocker when we found out she was pregnant, but never once was abortion even a thought in either of our minds (although I did have a jackass at work recommend it).

My wife volunteered at baltimore crisis pregnancy center for years. In the inner city. It is non profit place that does not consider abortion, but serves as counsel and resource for pregnant women and young mothers providing counseling, clothes, formula, bottles, adoption assistance, etc. She has seen the trauma brought on by abortion. Young girls who have had one and are pregnant again but have lived with the emotional consequences of abortion. She got at least ten calls per night that were immediate hang-ups when she told them that they don't do abortions. She had been there pretty late at night at times while I put the kids to bed just to talk with someone struggling with the idea of abortion or other issues. It was an extremely rewarding experience for her but unfortunately with 4 of our own now her/our time is much more limited.

She does this because she once was faced with some of the same problems they faced. Without going into too much detail, He was 18 months old when I met her and the adoption was finalized not too long ago (it took a long, long time). Taylor is our oldest of our 4 kids and I am the only father he has ever known. Believe you me it is better that way in this case.

Many places like planned parenthood not only advocate abortion, but actually pressure women (especially young girls) into getting one. they hammer home the belief that it is their "social responsibility" to not have a baby. They use scare tactics and then they perform the procedure for a fee or get re-imbursed by your tax dollars. Believe it or not, abortion is a very lucrative industry.

Even in cases of rape, incest, and yes health problems there are always people willing to adopt if a woman or girl is unable or unwilling to support a child for whatever reason. Carrying a child for 9 months to do the right thing is not as much to ask of her as it would be for her to live a lifetime of second guessing, sorrow, guilt, etc.

Sorry Mingez, I know you weren't trying to go to this topic, but you know how I am :roll:

 

[mingez]

Sorry Mingez, I know you weren't trying to go to this topic, but you know how I am

You mean, "you know how we BOTH are."

 

[Cherokee_MZ]

Anyone re-gear their TJ?

special K... thank for making an informed comment.... most people don't take the time to actually research... and i totally agree with you.. as much as i like offroading i think we need to watch where we go mudding.. cuz the environoment is more important than our shits and giggles.... and bush is a moron.

 

[wm69]

special K... thank for making an informed comment.... most people don't take the time to actually research... and i totally agree with you.. as much as i like offroading i think we need to watch where we go mudding.. cuz the environoment is more important than our shits and giggles.... and bush is a moron.

So you're willing to stop driving your jeep now and go get a civic hybrid right?

 

[TwistedCU]

Is it a REAL JEEP?!?

special K... thank for making an informed comment.... most people don't take the time to actually research... and i totally agree with you.. as much as i like offroading i think we need to watch where we go mudding.. cuz the environoment is more important than our shits and giggles.... and bush is a moron.

So you're willing to stop driving your jeep now and go get a civic hybrid right?

Yeah, right! Fat chance. Easy to talk about a greener earth and bluer skies when it is conveinient.

SpecialK's comments, although I do get a kick out of reading them, are informed - yes. Problem is he's only providing the left wing critique of the Bush administration and the left wing praises of the amazing John Kerry.

I could quite frankly take the time to list all of the true reversals of opinion that JFKerry has made. I could list his voting record on military spending. I could make comments about the special interests of his French wife and the Heinz corporation and it's record of outsourcing (don't forget this is where all Kerry's money comes from), I could reveal changes in his campaign promises from as early as the primary race or even between the first 2 debates. I could talk about the ways he discusses his position on terrorism (you know - the big "nuisance" that he'll deal with). I could talk about the fact that he picked an extremely unqualified running mate soley for the purpose of hoping to win his home state.

One thing to consider is that I have argued some of the things he has written soley because I see in his text the same old same old you hear from the democratic party heads.

Yes I am voting for Bush. Yes I think he is a much better man to run this country and lead our military than John Kerry. A better president to continue to revive the economy that appeared to be so wonderful under WJClinton with a balanced budget and stocks soaring. The economy that when companies were held accountable to reveal their books, stocks immediately plummeted. The economy that was riddled with extremely high interest rates, but people didn't care because their investments were doing sooo well. Their 401K was gearing them up for an early retirement. Well when that economy showed it's true condition, people lost jobs. That is not the fault of anything but a recession. The shortest one our country has ever experienced mind you.

Short because interest rates are low and taxes have been lessened.

All you hear the Dems talk about is how bad Bush and the boys have screwed up the economy. How many jobs they have lost for america. Well truth is they saved us from a depression. It could have been much worse but instead we are climbing out of it despite a defecit and despite being at war. Look at the last quarter, jobs have increased, interest rates are still low, and taxes are still down. The DOW is still flirting with 10,000 like it was before, but this time it is a TRUE value.

GO ahead! Vote your liberal anti-Bush in. Taxes will go up, interest rates will go back up, and there will be a short boom in employment that is a result of more cashflow in the hands of people and business. Then eventually we will feel the wrath of a tax and spend economy. This guy Kerry is not just your run-of-the-mill democrat. He is a liberal. He's one of the biggest liberals in the senate. Liberals are as liberals do. Tax, spend, and bust the humps of the people they say they are for.

One difference between SpecialK and Mingez is although SpecialK says he is middle of the road, and not a party line Dem, he consistantly regurgetates the DNC chatter. This is why I have given up trying to exchange text with him. Mingez, on the other hand, is a thinker. Sure I disagree with him on many things, but the guy thinks for himself and knows the other sides arguements well. That tells me he listens to both sides and draws his own conclusions. I have alot of respect for that whacky leftist pinko commie kool aid drinker Mingez, but SpecialK my man, you need to read more.

I'm out

 

[mud4feet]

I have alot of respect for that whacky leftist pinko commie kool aid drinker Mingez, but SpecialK my man, you need to read more.

C'mon, Twisted! Tell us how you really feel!!! :lol: :wink:

 

[Tug-n-pull]

You guys should not make jokes about your next president! Kerry is going to win this one and fix the mess we are in! Get ready. hehehee tug

 

[wm69]

You guys should not make jokes about your next president! Kerry is going to win this one and fix the mess we are in! Get ready. hehehee tug

Boy Tug, that just scares the mess outta me. Think I'll go branch dividian and build me a compound and declare myself "independent of the United States". Know why? Cause Kerry's gonna tax this country back to the early 30's......

 

[Tug-n-pull]

Fog light backup lights...

You guys should not make jokes about your next president! Kerry is going to win this one and fix the mess we are in! Get ready. hehehee tug

Boy Tug, that just scares the mess outta me. Think I'll go branch dividian and build me a compound and declare myself "independent of the United States". Know why? Cause Kerry's gonna tax this country back to the early 30's......

Taxes why more taxes maybe to get us out ot the debt your mr. Bush has massed in the past 4 years. Either we get taxed and get this debt "the biggest in history, bigger than the debt of all the combind president from Washington to Regan" paid or let it lay around for our kids and grand kids to pay for us.

You see I got nothing but hope cause Kerry could do the worst job that I could dream of and it would not be as bad as the reality of the Son of a Bush has poured out on this nation.

Know what I have kept my gloves off and my mouth shut for the most part. Not one post can you find where I have been down right negative on Bush. I listen you the so called Right Wingers pick and tear and pull apart the only hope we have in America.

Tell me what has Bush done for the un~rich, The old, the working class, the back bone folks of this counrty. Tell me who has brought us record high gas prices? Who lost jobs on his watch for the first time in over 70 years? Who has us in a war that we can not win? Like father like son! He will never finish what he has started or we would be kicken the Iran butt rather than trying to win their hearts. We would be buying that Iran and Afgan oil for 1/10th the price of the "preice gougeing far east texans" opec price.

Do you think Bush is no longer in the oil business? Do you think when the price goes up he and his family don't get a little richer at the cost of the common man? Are you proud to see your president kiss the Oil companys tail end while he tells the out of work people of this country to kiss his?

Do you really think that party lines are what has this counrty "a country at war" so divided? Could it be the fact that we are living under the rule of the first court appointed rather than elected president in history? Could it be the fact that we are at war in Iran cause Daddy did not finish the job over there the first time I need to go back and take care of old business? Could it be that he let the bin lauden dude escape cause of old family ties rather than kill the SOB when they had him cornered?

Have you ever looked into Bush's life record and really seen the train wreck of his life? All the failed business effort or lack there of that daddy had to pull him out of? Do you not see that Bush is a Puppet for Chiney the real president or should I say CEO of the united states? Placed into power by Chiney cause he knew the American Public would not have elected him as the front runner for obious reasons?

Now folks I know you all know me here! I try to calm things down as much as I can. I do what I can to keep things flowing along and not over moderate and keep my head for the most part. I have learned to respect and care for so many of you. I have opened my mouth and stuck my foot in couple of times but for every time I had my foot in my own mouth I have seen many of your feet in many of your mouths many times over that number. Biteing my lip holding back the rage I have felt so many times.

This can go on and on and on. Clip and pick the quotes I made for rebutal. That is just part of the process. My heart is at peace with this issue and my mind is clear. Now take it tear it apart. Facts and figures are the tools of the political machine, But what you feel in your heart is the tools of the people.

Kerry may not be the best man for the Job folks I can reason with that but Bush is not even qualified to pop the pimples that are on Kerrys butt. Want to see me go Right Wing bring a canidate that is better than what you have now, next election.

If I have hurt anyones feelings here please do not take it to heart. I have not attacked anyone here on jeepz personaly. If I did it was not my intent. I will not post anything political again untill after the election.

Should Kerry come out the victor I will be all about prayer for a new leader and the choices he makes being the right ones over the next four years. He will be my comander and chief and I will follow to the best of my ability. Should Bush win I will be all about prayer for a returning leader and the choices he makes being the right ones over the next four years. He will be my comander and chief and I will follow to the best of my ability. Difference is with Bush I will need more time for prayer! tug

 

[stacker46]

Most of the comments on this thread have focused on gun control and the war in Iraq (and now abortion). Some has been said about taxes - how Bush has lowered them, and how Kerry will raise them. Thing is, you have to pay taxes if you want to go to war and spend $200 billion. You have to pay taxes if you want to implement a "No Child Left Behind" act. You have to pay taxes if you want to lower health care cost. You have to pay taxes for the gov't to run!!! People gripe and complain when they have to pay taxes and don't realize how it affects the way the world works. Personally, I could care less if I have to pay a little more in my taxes in order for my kids to get a better education. I'll pay a little more if it means my family members will be able to afford the healthcare they need. And, I'll pay a little more if it helps us provide our military with what it needs to get the job done and come home. BUT, I certainly expect the upper class to pay their fair share of taxes. They shouldn't be exempt just because they make so much money that they don't know what to do with it.

I know there are a lot of people on here with kids, and I haven't heard any of them say anything about their stance on education. Why? Perhaps these kids all attend private schools, and the public education system isn't important to them.

There are a lot of issues within a campaign. War and guns are only two of them. Just make sure you know where your candidate stands on all of the important issues before you base your vote simply on one issue; whether it's gun control, war, etc.

Oh, and about the abortion issue.... neither candidate will ban abortion. It doesn't matter whether they are for or against it, because nothing will be done. There are too many people for it, and too many people against it, and to make a solid stand would lose too many votes and NO candidate is willing to do that.

 

[90Xjay]

I know there are a lot of people on here with kids, and I haven't heard any of them say anything about their stance on education. Why? Perhaps these kids all attend private schools, and the public education system isn't important to them

Well Here I AM!!!!!!

I have a 5yr old and a 2 year old.
We choose to homeschool because the goverment schools (previously known as public schools) told God in the early 60's "Get out of here and take your book with you"

If you see a school bus with the name "Whatever I.S.D" that is a joke.
Local school boards do make decisons on education but only through the filter of the Federal Goverment who says what and how to teach. Most teachers I know are good decent people, who work for a broken, vile, institution that teaches children that they evolved from animals and wonders why they act like animals. I still have to pay local school taxes even though my kids don't attend so I am still vocal to the boad of education. I also spend over $1000 per year out of pocket for curriculum and supplies to properly teach with. Considering the alternative, I just don't mind the expense. BTW my 5 year old easily reads multiple vowel words and complete sentences and writes very well.

 

[stacker46]

I wasn't trying to "call anyone out," nor was I putting down those that attend private schools. I have nothing against private school, or home school, or whatever decision is made. I was just asking why everyone seems to have their mind made up over certain issues and it seems that there hasn't been much attention given to other issues throughout this campain (by either side). I'm not referring to just the jeepz community... I'm talking about the American population in general.

One of my concerns relates to something you stated. You spend $1000 a year on materials, etc. so your child can have a good education. Under the recent No Child Left Behind laws, there have been lots of additional requirements and restrictions placed on public education and no additional funding provided. If there are going to be changes made requiring "better" teaching, then there has to be funding provided to do this.

 

[90Xjay]

Stacker,

I didn't think you were calling out or putting down anyone, I read your post and wanted to chime in.
You actually made a point for me in that the whole problem, as I see it is the Federal Govenment's role in what should be local decisions about education. For this I blame Republicans and Democrats for creating this mess and also the society that says I want a 2 or 3 income household so I can buy a house that I can't afford that I am still not happy with and get strapped down to car and boat payments and let the Government indoctinate my child to become a good, sensitive, global citizen