starting to think about a new tub for my CJ

[chinard]

Okay, i've been shopping around for replacement bodies and i actually found a canadian manufacturer that makes aluminium tubs for cj's at a decent price. (Candian is a good thing because that will save me tons of money on US excange, shipping, and duty costs)

http://www.aqualu.com


Anyways, on with the point of what i was getting to.
I'm thinking about doing all the work myself with some help from some of my stronger friends, so i'm just trying to organize things so that i can plan out this swap for sometime next spring.

I figure i should start by buying up as many supplies that i might need during the winter so that i will have everything on-hand when i buy the body and get them to ship it to my place.

I'm thinking that i should probably get a new set of hinges, various stainless steel bolts (not sure how many or what sizes i will need yet) new body mounts, and probably a brand new harness (probably splurge on a painless wiring kit) Not sure what else i will need tho.

after i get stocked up on parts, i'd like to find information on the best way to remove and dispose of the existing body (i was thinking about just cutting it into sections) and also find out the best way for locating and cutting all the firewall holes i will need. I was thinking about getting a huge piece of paper and mark the locations of the original holes as a template before dismembering the stock body.

Fortunately the CJ has a nice and easy dashboard, but i'm going to have to know about how to remove the steering column.

The rest of it should be pretty much a "bolt on" setup. The only thing that i am not sure of is exactly how many people will i need to safely lift the body. Will i need any special equipment to do this, like a hoist of some sort?

Of course finishing and painting i will leave for a professional body shop. My neighbourhood has hundreds of CHEAP paint shops with ovens and the whole setup.

Anyways, Thats what i am planning, and i'd like to hear from other people with helpful "do it yourself" advice for me as i'm planning this body swap.
If anybody knows of any well documented pages on these kinda body swaps i'd like to find out about them as well.[[/url]

 

[jps4jeep]

Get a couple of service manuals and other books (hayes, chiltons)! it is not that hard to swap a body, especially in a CJ. Should be able to do it in two week-ends with minimal problems(rusted hardware and stubborn bolts)
I would advise that you remove things in as big pieces as possible. For examlpe, take the dash off with the gauges in it and most of the wiring still attached!
Take lots of disasembly photos, LOTS! these can make a good reference when it comes time to put things pack to gether! Plus I wanna see!
Use Zip lock bags to put small bolts into, and MARK the bag, so when you go to the store to buy new grade 8 hardware, you will have a test piece in hand, and know exaclty where it goes when reassembly is required
Take your time! if you rush and just drop things at your side, You will soon loose parts! Get some boxes to organize things, for example, one box that will hold things from under the hood, one for under the dash!

The good part about this swap is you wont have to do too much work to the motor (accually none except remove the battery and things form the fire wall)

Good Luck!

Johnny

 

[chinard]

Hmm...
You know, I've noticed that they have CJ8 bodies on this site....
Does anybody know if the CJ8 body is an easy swap for a CJ7, or is the wheelbase different. I know that they tailgate area is considerably longer, but i'd kinda be interested in a direct swap for extra cargo space.

Of course i'd have to buy a new hardtop and stoft top

 

[ndnatty]

Don't think that's going to work. I have done a body and fram swap for my `79 cj-7. i agree that you should inventory all your parts you remove and all the wiring in a way that you can easily put back together. I wish I had done this! Don't forget about your exhaust, brake lines, fuel lines and gas tank mounting hardware! I assume this new tube wil have all the mounting locations in place, if not you should mark these on the new tub before install. The wiring under the dask is not all that difficult with the painless (this is what i installed too) there are a couple of good sites out there that can walk you through it too if you need (have the sights on my home computer if needed). Also the steering wheel is pretty easy to get out of my `79; just unbolt the connection in the engine compartment, the bolts under the steering wheel and at the firewall, then the wiring harness (theses can be a bitch to get loose) then just pull it straight out. Good luck

 

[TerryMason]

I saved alot of money by buying an 88 Wrangler and parting it out. The wranglers have a galvanized body, so it shouldn't rust again.

I was even able to sell the old tub for $100 and get them to haul it away.

The money from the seats, engine, transmission, top, etc paid for the cost of the second jeep. Just try to find one with a blown engine or the like.

 

[Inspector-Gadget]

loose exhust

Hello chinard,

I cannot presently add much of substance to the great advice given above, but I am going to try and refresh what little of my memory remains on the topics of electrolytic and galvanic corrosion. After that refresher, perhaps I can add something of value to this thread

Someone save me the effort and brain-strain. Please chime in as regards the wisdom of using stainless steel fasteners on an aluminum body with a steel frame in a damp climate where copious amounts of salt are routinely applied to the roads during winter.

Dissimilar metals, nobility of metals, stray electrical currents and all that, you know.

Keep in mind that when I went to school we had only bronze to worry about. Things were so much simpler then.

:wink:

Regards,

Gadget

 

[BakedAlaskan]

Pharus and non pharus metals, don't work together unless insulated from each other. (Plumbing knowlege :wink: ) It will cause electrolisous (sp) and the metal will corrode from the inside out. I am honestly not sure if Aluminum, Stainless Steel, and plain iron are pharus or not?

Aluminum I would skip because of cost, needing to be a pro to weld on, isn't the best ground.

Galvinized is poisonous to weld, but a used Wrangler tub would be worth it anyways if the price was right.

As far as corrosion, I have often wondered why nobody uses Zinks on rigs. They are the shieet on boats. I haven't actually added any before but under the theory it would save a LOT of rust problems. I have replaced a ton on boats, and is flat amazing when you see one without them. Corrosion everywhere.

Sorry no help on the real question. Except when marking your Ziplocks. Your shorthand makes no sense in a month. So mark them clearly and easy enough for a dumass to understand where they go.
Trust me on this tip. :roll:

 

[Inspector-Gadget]

Hello again, chinard,

RE: Electrolytic and galvanic corrosion revisited

I, like BakedAlaskan, approach the corrosion question from a boating background. A disclaimer: I am not a metallurgist, I don't play one on TV, and I did not stay at a Holiday Inn, Express last night. Therefore, take what follows as anecdotal, merely some ideas to ponder, as opposed to "metallurgic gospel."

First: check out the "FAQ" on the aqualu.com website. I find it significant that corrosion is the topic first addressed in the FAQ.

Second: It could be a worthwhile investment of time to read the info available at the following two websites:

http://marinesurvey.com/yacht/corrosion_1.htm

and

http://www.corrosion-doctors.org/Aircraft/galvseri-sea.htm

Third: Among salt-water sailors, it is common knowledge that using stainless steel fasteners on aluminum structural components is a questionable practice.

You live in Toronto, I live near Syracuse: similar weather environments. For practical purposes, our vehicles live for six months a year in a near salt-water environment. For those Jeepers living in Arizona, Colorado or Death Valley, California, this corrosion thing is surely much ado about nothing. But I believe corrosion should be a significant consideration in our locales.

There are, to be sure, many alloys of aluminum and stainless steel. Corrosion characteristics vary and there are good and bad mixes of metals.

For whatever it might be worth, I would query the people at aqualu closely before I purchased an aluminum Jeep tub and expended the considerable effort required for installation.

In closing, know that I hate writing posts like this one. I am sure that this post has a high negativity quotient. Be assured, my only motive is to prevent a possible disaster in the making.

Your project is one requiring careful pre-wrench research.

Regards,

Gadget

PS: The Ark was built by amateurs. The Titanic was built by professionals.

 

[Snitty]

are you saying that factory wrangler tubs are galvanized? and that i have to be quite careful when welding mine?

 

[redrooster]

No, a CJ8 tub will not work on a CJ7 frame (not without cutting 10" out behind the seats).
Stainless is notorious for gaulding to other metals (stripping them out). Use grade 8 coated bolts (gold in color) and nylon lock nuts.
Use the aluminum or fiberglass tub. Aluminum is lighter and you don't have to paint it. Have all you hardware beadblasted and prime it with Sherwin Williams 988 self etching primer. It's good stuff. Re-use as much as you can so you can save up for all the goodies.
Painless harnesses are labeled the full length of the wire and come long enough to run them where you want. That way you don't have to cut multiple holes in the firewall. They even have the wires for all of your lights.
Get a Mojave heater from Quadratec. It is much easier than fooling with the factory unit and looks better. You can loose about half of the knobs and pull cables from the dash with this unit also. Make the dash from a piece of aluminum sheet and cut holes for the gauges with a holesaw. Auntie up for some Autometer Phantom gauges.
Two guys can pick up a CJ tub if the seats and roll bar are removed. Four if it makes you more comfortable.
I don't know about all that electrolysis stuff. If your grounds are all connected to the body or frame and the negetive side of the battery is grounded, you shouldn't have mysterious electrical problems. Jeep wiring is junk so get rid of all that.
Get polyurethane body mounts and motor mounts and you should have a good corrosion resistant rig.
Remember to spend the money where it counts..you only want to do this once. Trust me.

 

[chinard]

In closing, know that I hate writing posts like this one. I am sure that this post has a high negativity quotient. Be assured, my only motive is to prevent a possible disaster in the making.

Your project is one requiring careful pre-wrench research.

This is precisely why i am bringing this post up now. I'm not planning to do this until spring at the earliest which is why i'm planning this out like a shuttle mission (except without the blowing-up parts)
And so far the advice i've been getting from people has been great.

So stainless bolts is right out, but i do need to talk to someone about metallurgy and get an "official" position as to if aluminium is going to pose a problem as far as the electrolytic reactions go. I'll also pose the question to aqualu... So far they've been helpful with answering my questions.
The CJ-8 body was just a fantasy...
I'm going to look for this Mojave heater mentioned as well. I just upgraded my heater motor on the stock heater core with the chevy blazer motor, but i'm not exactly happy with it for power consumption reasons.
Replacing the wiring harness was already a done deal. Painless may be expensive, but i might as well since i'm doing the rest.
I spoke to aqualu and verified that the tub is 295lbs which isnt that heavy. I'm still gonna arrange for 3-4 people just for safety sake.
I'm gonna stick with the stock dash for now. Later on i've got my eye on this nice "diamond cut" aluminium dash pannel that looks quite pimpin'

On a slightly side related note, i'm also trying to track down a canadian source for POR-15. Tried the local "canadian tire" stores (similar to autozone) and they don't know what i'm talking about

Anyways, Keep the advice coming...